Motorcycle Deaths

[catfish1978]

Originally Posted by Hondaguy

I believe the increase in ridership = the increase in deaths. 4500 deaths out of 5 MILLION plus riders is not something to be alarmed about. less than 1% of all riders don;'t make it home on any given trip/.

In how many of those 4500 deaths was the rider at fault im gonna guess alot less than half

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[Earthling789]

Originally Posted by oblivion_twister

the level stays the same because they improve everything except current driver education. In the medical profession I'm required to get 30 hours plus of continuing education. Why are drivers not required to do the same? Cages are much more dangerous and more numerous than me?

I agree to a point... your continuing education is because your profession changes from year to year... new methods, new techniques, new laws, etc. (I was also in medical profession for many years)...

BUT, the basic automobile has not changed much in the past 100 years... Four wheels, accelerator pedal, brake pedal, clutch pedal (if applicable), gear selector, steering wheel... yep... they're the same in my my 50's and '60's vehicles, just like they are in my 2008 Ford... just like they are in my '74 Beetle...

Traffic laws are pretty much the same as they were when my grandparents were teenagers... save a few new speed laws, parking regulations... and of course the "local restrictions" that change every now and then...

So, what NEW do we need to teach a licensed driver?

Not trying to be an a$$ here... just being rational. There's nothing "new" to teach...

I think the main issue today is that cars are SO much safer, so people rely on the safety features of their cages to protect them from their "mistakes"... we as drivers have gotten complacent in our duties as DRIVERS to actually DRIVE the vehicle... hell, some of the new ones practically drive themselves anyway... with auto-braking, blind-spot warnings, back-up cameras and sensors, and parking-assist (just when did parallel parking become an "option" or require "assistance"?)

Driver's ed is a joke... at least in our school system... they teach them nothing about driving, more about where to get the best lunch or which areas of town to avoid during specific parts of the day (speed traps and cop hangouts).

Oh, and don't get me started on the actual driving test.... takes < 10-minutes and goes through two stop signs, two red-lights, a 3-point turn-around, and parallel parking on a deserted street (using a junk-car as your "target" to park behind).... and all of this on side-streets, covering < 2-miles of actual "driving"..... sheesh!

I'd be all for a required course like the BRC for beginning cage drivers. Some states won't give you a motorcycle endorsement without successful completion of BRC, so why allow a cage driver to get their license without completion of an approved course?? Anyone else see a problem with that?

[adlowe]

Originally Posted by Earthling789

...back-up cameras and sensors...

[rant]Man, I hate those things. My wife's company makes a boatload of money and once they become mandatory (2014?) they'll need a lot more boats. But in my experience, they make drivers MORE DANGEROUS.

Why do I say that? Three times I've had people with backup sensors back right into my pickup truck's bumper. All in parking lots so no real damage but, come on, my truck is a white Dodge Ram 3500 crew cab long (8') bed with a cap. The only way you can't see it is if I bury it with snow -- and then it's still a big lump. But three times, THREE TIMES, idiots in parking lots throw their transmission into R and step on the gas without ever looking. Not even in the rear view mirror.

It's probably happened more than three times but that's all that I've personally witnessed. That's why my trailer hitch is ALWAYS on the truck.

Pretty soon, NHTSA is going to mandate that we put flashing beepers on kids so they don't get run over by people backing out of driveways with their backup sensors.[/rant]

[adlowe]

Originally Posted by catfish1978

In how many of those 4500 deaths was the rider at fault im gonna guess alot less than half

I'll bet you're wrong. (Groundrule: Getting into an accident while riding drunk is the rider's fault, especially when it is a single-vehicle accident.)

[jpr1968]

Originally Posted by adlowe

I'll bet you're wrong. (Groundrule: Getting into an accident while riding drunk is the rider's fault, especially when it is a single-vehicle accident.)

Without seeing the actual numbers neither GUESS is right or wrong. Numbers I've seen in the past say it's about 50% ratio on who's fault it was. I believed it's got a lot to do with driver education on both sides. They need to educate all drivers about motorcycles and motorcyclists need a better education on responsible riding.

[Hondaguy]

Originally Posted by catfish1978

In how many of those 4500 deaths was the rider at fault im gonna guess alot less than half

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Actually according to the last study which can be less relevant today as we have far more inexperienced riders and texting issues.....

HALF of ALL deaths were alcohol related. 25% were single rider errors, 75% vehicle on vehicle, only 66% of them the fault of the "other guy"

The point is 4500 deaths among 5 million riders every year is a statistic I can live with. I also believe riders can avoid 99% of all "other guy" accidents as well if they slow, anticipate and seek exit. Many "just ride" Accelerate to Blow past yellows (yes legal but risky nevertheless) Install modulators and extra lights up front....Both of which nearly eliminated all close calls from the front for me. I saw an immediate increase in "start stops" by crossing traffic. Not wearing all black helps as well to be seen ,

There are many things riders can do to lower their odds of multi vehicle get offs. and nearly EVERYTHING to do with singular bike get offs with the exception of the <3% equipment failures, <2% road hazards and 1% animal take outs.

Less than 1% of all riders will die riding every year... That's a statistic that should not be alarming considering what Is see around here parked in front of bars in Murrells Inlet every Sunday LOL.

I view those odds as very good. Not so much if you are between 16-24 way over represented in deaths.......30-50 are the best years....

The new report being conducted should be interesting...

"The Hurt Report"

Educating drivers is not going to help...people have been riding with motorcycles for the same time they have been driving, Truckers would say the same thing about drivers and riders. We are creatures of habit. How many still smoke now that we KNOW without a doubt the health risks? Many drivers believe riding a motorcycle is right up there with jumping out of a perfectly operating aircraft. They already think we are crazy.

[jpr1968]

You do realize the Hurt Report is a very old study.

[Hondaguy]

Originally Posted by jpr1968

You do realize the Hurt Report is a very old study.

Yes I do but I am going to bet not all that much has changed. In fact I will venture to the end of the limb here and predict the single vehicle death rate goes HIGHER and the multi vehicle lower. because of the far more powerful machines, more riders, and the stunt bike craze among the sport bike riders on public roads as well as the sudden older boomer getting their first bike to resolve mid life crisis issues because a Vette costs too much. ...However texting may even the score. The new statistics will be interesting but that doesn't change the current statistical evidence of less than 1% losing their lives on a bike. and 2% getting injured, (1% of them fatally)

Its not something I think about much. If the statistic were alarming...say 25% of all riders will have an injurious get off........I would not ride. too risky.

[Phil]

Originally Posted by RJDoles

texting drivers would be forced to finish their text while sitting at a light

Texting drivers should be yanked out of their vehicles and slapped silly; or better yet, forced to view pictures of CrazyDave in his bikini for 8-hours straight.........

Phil

[adlowe]

Originally Posted by jpr1968

Without seeing the actual numbers neither GUESS is right or wrong. Numbers I've seen in the past say it's about 50% ratio on who's fault it was. I believed it's got a lot to do with driver education on both sides. They need to educate all drivers about motorcycles and motorcyclists need a better education on responsible riding.

That, jpr, would make me right -- I'm betting that "...the rider at fault im gonna guess alot less than half" is wrong.