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Found this on my porch today...

10K views 76 replies 19 participants last post by  Coop 
#1 · (Edited)
https://s19.postimg.cc/5j5pcjso3/2018-03-02_16.25.48.jpg

Tire is a 185/65/15 StarFire RS-C 2.0 (StarFire is a Cooper tire subsidiary)
https://s19.postimg.cc/f3pbzfaab/2018-03-02_16.26.05.jpg

Tire is about 1" shorter and 1/2" wider than stock 170/80/15.
Should get me a little more acceleration on the bottom end, and not worried about top end since I don't even get into 4th gear (my top gear) till 65 mph.

https://s19.postimg.cc/w48884agz/2018-03-02_16.25.57.jpg
No idea how good (or bad) this tire will be, but for $40, I figured why not.

I got some nickle plated 90° valve stems for $10
https://s19.postimg.cc/nlys3rw8j/2018-03-02_16.26.13.jpg

I got a spare rim off e-bay for $55
https://s19.postimg.cc/bk3e9lkf7/2018-03-02_16.26.20.jpg
I want to have a spare rim so if I had problems I could still ride the bike

And I still have problems. I can't get the bead to seat.
https://s19.postimg.cc/up6njdeir/2018-03-02_18.08.45.jpg
My compressor will only inflate to ~80 PSI, and apparently it is not enough to get it to pop.
I had cleaned the bead seat (used 320 then 400 grit sand paper) and have tried soapy water and even some Kentucky Jelly. Just not enough pressure I guess (seems 15" motorcycle rims (just over 15") and 15" car tires (just under 15") have a hard time seating, 100 psi is normal from what I can find).
I have also read I may need to reposition the tire (right now part of it is seated, part is not, possibly needs to be all unseated). I will be trying that tomorrow, and if not, Monday have a friend with a compressor that I can do up to 120 psi (don't want to go that high though).

So for $105 (about the cost of a "quality" motorcycle tire), I will be giving the Darkside a try.

edit: forgot to add, I plan on using some Ride On tire sealer/balancer to balance the tire.
I will be using the ATV stuff. Have read many use it instead of the motorcycle specific one with good results. While the ATV one does not state it is for balanceing tires, it does work for that as well (and is a lot cheaper than the motorcycle version).
It was $20 for a 32 oz bottle (enough for front (8-10 oz) and rear (12-15 oz) tire). The Motorcycle stuff is around $15 for and 8 oz bottle, and you need around 3 bottles for front and rear tire.
 
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#2 ·
Tell us how you like it. I am tempted also. I had looked at a lot of car tires over years of working on cars. But I am no tire expert.
I looked at the traction rating, an A would be a good choice. The temperature rating of A is also good. But noticed the 400 tread wear rating. So it will last a long time under normal driving. But I believe it means a harder rubber compound. So tell us how the traction is in real life driving. Some tires with an AA traction rating will have a lower tread wear rating because of a softer rubber but better grip. So I am interested in your findings. Of course the Bridgestone Spitfire tires on my bike now are like grease on anything but dry roads.

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/magazine/2015/09/the-truth-about-tire-treadwear/index.htm

Treadwear grade

A government-required number that indicates a tire’s expected wear. A grade of 300 denotes a tire that will wear three times as well as a tire graded 100. But the numbers are assigned by tire manufacturers, not an independent third party.
Traction and temperature scores

Those scores denote a tire’s wet-stopping ability and temperature resistance. For traction, AA is best, C is worst. For temperature resistance, scores range from A (best) to C.
 
#4 ·
I will definitely post up how it does once I get it on and riding.
I have been researching it for a few weeks reading almost everything online I can find.
I know the risks of it and am comfortable taking them.

Swifty, the 400 rating is not too bad, still a "sticky" tire for the most part.
I have not really seen any real world reviews of this tire (on a car, much less a bike), so I am interested to see how it lasts. I have had my bike for almost 6 months and have only put ~2000 miles on it, so will take me a long time to wear this thing out. I will probably hit the age mark (made in 10/2017, good till 2013) before the tread wears out.
Just in the 2000 miles I have put on the Dunlop 404 on the bike now I can see some significant wear (no idea of the actual miles on the tires, but they are over 6 years old).

Once I get this sorted out, I need to decide on a front tire (am thinking the Perelli MT66, maybe a Shinko 777) and get that put on.
 
#7 ·
I had similar mounting issues when I tried to mount a C/T. I went to 125 psi and it still did not seat. I have read of folks going as high as 150 psi to mount a 15" C/T. While I really want to go this route I do not like such a high seating pressure. I may do like you and get a spare rim to work this out with a different tire so I can still ride the bike.

Look at the Bridgestone BT-45 or BT-45V "Rear" tires to mount on the front (double darkside). I did this and will do it again!
 
#9 ·
Yeah, I read about your attempt, but you were using a tube, which makes it even harder to seat.

I can't do double dark, nobody makes a 19" rear tire. And I don't feel like trying to figure out what other Honda's have an 18" rim that will have the speedo and brake setup on the correct side, that mounts correctly, and looks similar to what is on the bike now.

Use the shortest compressor hose you can since long hoses will really lower the psi at the nozzle end. I have over a hundred feet of hose on mine, and we had to install a 25 footer that day.
My compressor only does ~100 psi max, I have a 25 ft hose. Problem is it does not kick on till 80 PSI. I was able to get it to ~90 PSI in the tire after I posted last night. It is sitting outside in the sun now at that pressure, if it seats, great, if not, I will mess with it more this afternoon.

Just got back from a 2 hour ride with my daughter (momma finally said she could do some longer rides with me). Bike does not ride well with the two of us, but we are over the limit of it (I am 340, she is 120), so maybe the CT will help a little with the ride when 2 up.
 
#8 ·
My compressor will only inflate to ~80 PSI, and apparently it is not enough to get it to pop.
I had cleaned the bead seat (used 320 then 400 grit sand paper) and have tried soapy water and even some Kentucky Jelly. Just not enough pressure I guess (seems 15" motorcycle rims (just over 15") and 15" car tires (just under 15") have a hard time seating, 100 psi is normal from what I can find).
I have also read I may need to reposition the tire (right now part of it is seated, part is not, possibly needs to be all unseated). I will be trying that tomorrow, and if not, Monday have a friend with a compressor that I can do up to 120 psi (don't want to go that high though).
When my neighbor and riding buddy put a 205 75 15 trailer tire on his 2000 Shadow Spirit VT1100C (same bike as mine), we had a helluva time getting the bead to seat. Took everything my 145 psi compressor had before it finally snapped in. He loves the tire and says he doesn't notice any handling differences in it. Of course we are both very conservative riders and don't ever try to push our bikes to see what they will do or how they will handle.

Use the shortest compressor hose you can since long hoses will really lower the psi at the nozzle end. I have over a hundred feet of hose on mine, and we had to install a 25 footer that day.
 
#10 ·
I've seen some tyre sellers/fitters doing this.

What they do is they have a fairly large tank (around the size of a SCUBA tank) with a 1-2" pipe coming off it (I can't recall the size but I think more 2"), the end of the pipe flattened, and a valve on the pipe (a quick ball valve that only has 1/4 turn from fully closed to fully open). And an inlet valve to go to the compressor.

They fill the tank with air, put the flat end under the edge of the bead, and open the valve quickly. The air rushing in causes the tyre to pop into place.

You could probably pop down to such a place, slip them a fiver, and be home again before your coffee had cooled.
 
#11 ·
That will be my final option.

The sun went away after only about a hour with the tire in the sun, so barely even got warm.
I did try getting the entire bead undone and trying that way with lots and lots of lube, but it still only seated 1/2 the tire on each side.
Monday I will go to my friends with a bigger compressor (150 psi if I recall) and will try up to about 120 psi.
If that does not work, I know of a few tire shops that would do it for a few bucks.
 
#12 ·
My favorite tire lube is Windex, slippery when wet, but after drying doesn't come back to life in the wet like soap can creating a potential problem if the tire goes flat in the rain.
I've had it happen years ago on a dirt bike, luckily it wasn't a front tire.
Not that your rim/tire combination is going to part company too easily even if deflated.
 
#14 · (Edited)
This is what you need to find, someone who has one similar to this.https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200673910_200673910. Its not the pressure but the sudden rush of air that comes out of the tire inf-later tank.Or try a ratchet strap around the outside of the tire fill it partway w/air,tighten it a little then add more air then tighten strap...., it worked for me with a regular tubeless Shinko 777HD.
 
#15 ·
That does look pretty cool.....

Please don't get me wrong! Not knocking the look, or the handling or the safety aspect. From everything I've read and heard, they look great, handle perfect and are totally safe.

But the one thing that's keeping me from using a car tire is the flat repair issue. Will a motorcycle shop repair a car tire on a motorcycle?

I've had a flat a few times while out riding; once I was pretty far from home, and it was on Sunday. I was lucky enough to find a shop that would do the repair on a Sunday, but I wonder if they'd even repair a car tire?

Do you car tire guys ever worry about a flat tire when you're far from home? Or has it ever happened to you...... If so I'd like to hear about it and how you deal with it.
Phil
 
#16 ·
That does look pretty cool.....

Please don't get me wrong! Not knocking the look, or the handling or the safety aspect. From everything I've read and heard, they look great, handle perfect and are totally safe.

But the one thing that's keeping me from using a car tire is the flat repair issue. Will a motorcycle shop repair a car tire on a motorcycle?

I've had a flat a few times while out riding; once I was pretty far from home, and it was on Sunday. I was lucky enough to find a shop that would do the repair on a Sunday, but I wonder if they'd even repair a car tire?

Do you car tire guys ever worry about a flat tire when you're far from home? Or has it ever happened to you...... If so I'd like to hear about it and how you deal with it.
Phil
Phil, remember back a hundred years or so around here and half the members were riding from the darkside. All the debates!!!!!
 
#19 ·
I put 16001 miles on the 1st ct I used, one flat and it was at home. Towed it to the indy bike shop and they fixed me up. I had a bit over 29000 miles on the 2nd ct when I retired from riding. The buyer never blinked about the tire, and it still had tread within the safety margins.
 
#21 ·
Thanks for that info old dad,...... I was really curious if a motorcycle shop would actually work on a car tire?

Come to think of it, didn't the Boss Hoss Motorcycles come from the factory with car tires? Well, at least on the rear.

Phil
 
#22 ·
I carry a plug kit and a mini compressor. Not concerned with a flat that just leaks down.
Just for the heckuvit.....
When inflating do you have the Schrader valve in the tire? This cause tire to inflate slower and will prevent it from getting SHOCKED into seating.
If you take the tire/rim to a bike ship tell them it's for a side car set up. They just may buy into it and hook you up. I know several that have used it and it worked.
I'm a double dark side guy now, I was an opponent of it until I saw it in action and knew the right questions to ask. Now I see ZERO negatives!





Photobucket stinks!
 
#23 ·
I carry a plug kit and a mini compressor. Not concerned with a flat that just leaks down.
Just for the heckuvit.....
When inflating do you have the Schrader valve in the tire? This cause tire to inflate slower and will prevent it from getting SHOCKED into seating.
If you take the tire/rim to a bike ship tell them it's for a side car set up. They just may buy into it and hook you up. I know several that have used it and it worked.
I'm a double dark side guy now, I was an opponent of it until I saw it in action and knew the right questions to ask. Now I see ZERO negatives
More good info.....

Thanks,
Phil
 
#27 ·
Well, I am getting a little frustrated.

Went to my friends shop this morning, and it is closed down. Apparently he was being a deadbeat and not paying his bills, so he was kicked out.
So I go to the hole in the wall tire place, and well, they had closed. Actually shop looks like it may have flooded and they did not do anything with it after that.
Went to another tire shop, they would not even touch it. Went to a 3rd shop, he attempted, but did not want to go over 90 PSI (which I was able to do at home). At least he did not charge me anything.

Sigh. :|

Was over at my brother in laws borrowing his pressure washer, and saw he had a pancake style compressor that had "150 psi" printed on it. Hmm...
He lets me bring it home, and I start to use it. Similar problem, it is only a 4 gallon tank, so it takes 2-3 fills for it to even get to 100 PSI, and once it does, the pressure relief on the tank decides to open up @ ~110 psi and it will not go higher. An almost brand new compressor that he has used maybe an hour or two.
So here I am again sitting @ around 95 psi in the tire with it still not seated.

I have one more tire place I know of that may do it, but if not, I will just drive to a part of town that has used tire shops on every corner, I am sure I could find someone that will do it.
 
#30 ·
Try this, it worked for me. Go ahead and mount the tire and wheel on your bike and put as much pressure in it that your compressor can muster. Get the rear wheel off the ground with a jack or whatever you have so you can start the bike and put it in gear, then go through the gears till you are in high and just nail it. Got to love centrifugal force!! Good luck.
 
#28 ·
A friendly truck tire place will probably put it in a cage, go the other side of the wall and watch it with a mirror as it seats or blows up.
They are used to being careful these days.

I remember decades ago in my town a guy had his head blown clean off inflating a truck tire outside the cage and there's stories of a similar thing happening round the corner from where I live back in the 1930's where a guy decided to use a milk churn as a pressure tank. So compressed air is not to be fooled with and if professionals don't want to take it over 90 psi they may have their reasons.
 
#29 ·
Yes compressed air can be dangerous and the stories about truck tires blowing up usually always are with split rims that have a separate piece like a circlip that gets blown off. A new tire can stand a lot of pressure.

I worked at a dealership and a another fellow was doing a service where we rotate tires. The car was up on the hoist about shoulder height, and the front tire of this Nissan Maxima he dropped to the floor and it bounced like a super ball. Both the front tires were at 100 # and the rears were at 60#. The old fellow that owned the car put more pressure in to "get rid of the side bulge".
Who knows how long they were driven like that.

We used to use a big rubber mallet and hit the side wall of a tire that was not seating easily.
How about this idea. Get some very hot water and put dish soap in it and put in on the area that is still stuck. And maybe tap the side wall with a large mallet also to flex the side and get the bead to move up and out.
But the tire itself will not blow up at 100 # or even a bit more. But still be careful .
 
#31 ·
Not say to try this, BUT....
I just helped a buddy mount 2 trailer tires. He(we) did the starter fluid method. It worked!
Has anyone here used this in a bike? Not sure if it would work or not, but it was effective... only a short 2 second max squirt of starter fluid and wooopowyow!!!! She was seated!
****No-one should try this cuz I said so, cuz I was only the supplier of the starter fluid and compressor, not the "Hold my Beer and watch this" fella! You are own your own if you do!!!




Photobucket stinks!
 
#33 ·
Not say to try this, BUT....
I just helped a buddy mount 2 trailer tires. He(we) did the starter fluid method. It worked!
Has anyone here used this in a bike? Not sure if it would work or not, but it was effective... only a short 2 second max squirt of starter fluid and wooopowyow!!!! She was seated!
****No-one should try this cuz I said so, cuz I was only the supplier of the starter fluid and compressor, not the "Hold my Beer and watch this" fella! You are own your own if you do!!!
Agree you're potentially taking your limbs in your hands trying this..I'd suggest a lit rag (or candle or whatever) on a very long stick.. But lots of people have done it and mythbusters even managed to get it to work. If they could figure it out anyone can!

Not sure if I would want to do it to my tyres, but I guess a couple of fill/empty/fill cycles might clear out any combustion residue that could potentially be harmful to the tyre. Getting it seated is the main thing..

(Course, you could cheat and use a tube... ;) )
 
#32 ·
I used vasoline on the bead and rim ,Hooked on the tire inflater and stood away from the tire turned on the compressor from 20 feet away and let her pop under a car .Not the best way but..........
 
#35 ·
Well, still not fully seated. :crying:

I went to a few shops, none would put in more than 90 PSI, even with a tire cage.
Finally found one that said that he would not, but handed me his airhose and pressure gauge and said have at it.
Deflated it, re-lubed with some of his slime, and filled it to 125 PSI.
Same as before, about 3/4 seated on both sides. Told the guy thanks and gave him 5 bucks for letting me use his hose.
It sat in the back of my truck most of the day to sit in the sun (it was sitting upright), when I went out that evening, found the tire lying flat in the bed of the truck, one side had seated completely!:surprise:
Other side had not changed. :(
Thursday I may head back over to the same shop and try one more time on the side that has not seated yet. Till then it is still sitting in the back of my truck, maybe it will be warmer tomorrow and pop then.
 
#37 ·
Ok, let's get this problem solved. My buddy across the street has the same bike as I do, a 2000 Honda Shadow Spirit VT1100C. He bought a 205 trailer tire from Walmart which is theeeeee widest tire that will fit on a Shadow.

Fill it to 125 psi. Then take the tire and bounce the living hell out of it like a basketball. Slam it into the ground and bounce it good. The bouncing part is the KEY ingredient. It'll pop and seat like a dream. If you try inflating it without bouncing it, till it pops, you're wasting your time.

Do this, then report back with your success story. :)
 
#36 ·
At least you are getting some progress.

Years ago I worked at a Toyota dealership and was under a Corolla on the hoist and noticed the right front tire inner bead was not seated. A few inches were not out to the wheel. I can't remember how new the tires were but it had been running around in the streets for a little while at least not fully seated.

But not so good on a bike.
 
#39 ·
Lucky.

Last one I had fitted (which is a nice tyre and I'll go back to one when it's time is up) was slightly narrower and simple could not be inflated, just no way to get the thing wide enough to fit on the rim on both sides, and with a gap all around it no amount of air you can shove through the valve would work.

Hence the idea of taking it to a shop with a type of air-cannon they use to pop tyres on. I'd expect any tyre shop would have them but perhaps it's only a Kiwi thing.

Reminds me, have to visit a tyre shop about my front tyre :)
 
#42 ·
#44 ·
Seating a tire

One thing you could try with trying to seat the tire is a heat gun. DO NOT hold it to close but it will help you slowly seat the tire. While it is pressurized hold the heat gun on the tire and hit it with a rubber mallet at the same time, this will allow the rubber to flex and work its way to the bead. I have used this method in the past and it worked fairly well plus its much quicker than waiting for the tire to heat up out in the sun all day.
 
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