Oilology - Page 3 - Honda Shadow Forums : Shadow Motorcycle Forum
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post #21 of 360 (permalink) Old 03-17-2009, 08:14 AM
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And the good news is that the filter came off!! I ended up using the "channel lock" type. Had to buy it, but no big deal.....but the new filter on, hand tight after I lubricated the gasket first.....
You are right..I put quite a hurting on the old filter before it budged......but all is well and I rode the bike to work this morning.....Thanks to all for the help!




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post #22 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-09-2009, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h13man
only to Puralator PL14612(2.5 in. lg.), PL14610 (3.5 in. lg.). They cost under $3.00 to boot. Fram is considered by most as a "sub par" filter now days.
the guts might be different but the fram and purolator filter come from the same plant.

What the hell, I'm full of useless info today... Purolator Courier was born out of Purolator filters. They had their own trucks to distribute their product and started moving other peoples products as well. And so it started.
Fram or Allied Signal or whatever the parent company is this week makes purolator filters.



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post #23 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-12-2009, 11:31 PM
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what if

I read most of these post and markc you must be good at copy and paste, I found most all the info online. But auto / truck oil in a bike wet clutch. You can tell everyone looking for a cheap way out this stuff but your going to cost people big bucks in the long run. If Honda wanted you to use it there manual would say so. I've worked off and on for years at service centers and would never put out this stuff. The same is with auto parts, you get what you pay for. Go to a off brand and save bucks and replace it in less time than using OEM. I would love to see your diploma on cut and paste. I'm going for the big bucks and be a brain surgeon. I can cut and paste my page and get a Diploma in Neurology.

baffle them with bs
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post #24 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-13-2009, 04:28 AM Thread Starter
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Re: what if

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbikes.rule
I read most of these post and markc you must be good at copy and paste, I found most all the info online. But auto / truck oil in a bike wet clutch. You can tell everyone looking for a cheap way out this stuff but your going to cost people big bucks in the long run. If Honda wanted you to use it there manual would say so. I've worked off and on for years at service centers and would never put out this stuff. The same is with auto parts, you get what you pay for. Go to a off brand and save bucks and replace it in less time than using OEM. I would love to see your diploma on cut and paste. I'm going for the big bucks and be a brain surgeon. I can cut and paste my page and get a Diploma in Neurology.

baffle them with bs
OldBikers~Rule
In the years that the oilology has been up not ONE person has had a problem with using non specific motor oils with a wet clutch! not ONE! (if they had followed a few simple rules like not using the energy conserving automotive oils)

And if you've found the EXACT information (word for word) on the internet then you were probably looking at my web page!

Some of my research (information) was done using the internet, true! but only if it could be CONFIRMED by other sources! and then applied in my own world!

I've been around motorcycles most of my life even as a young child!
before I was sixteen I worked in a motorcycle dealer ship putting NEW bikes together!

And the the owners manual does tell us we CAN use other oils other than Honda specific oil, but the oil needs to meet certain requirements!

Yea, those stealers really like it when they can convince someone that the only oil they can put in their bike is sold at a STEALER ship! and the parts counter people go right along with it! LOL!

They are COUNTLESS people that use the heavy duty truck oils in their Asian motorcycles.


More later!
I have to go to work now, I work as a mechanic for a warehouse!

You Have got to be kidding me!
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post #25 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-13-2009, 03:08 PM Thread Starter
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okay, I'm back!

After looking over your post the ONLY stand that you make against the information in this thread is this,

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbikes.rule
If Honda wanted you to use it there manual would say so. (speakinig of Auto/Truck oils)
And you think I got ALL my information off the internet! LOL!

Below is a scan from the Honda OEM service manual and what it really states about the recommended oil for our bikes.

Click image to view full screen.

I posted this picture on this forum OCT-4-2005 during an oil debate, boy! that's really bad now I'm recycling information



Notice it says "Equivalent"

Also, a lot of the information I used in this topic is stuff I collected that I posted in COUNTLESS oil debates that I have been involved with on this forum sense 2004.
I would say out of my near 5000 post probably over 3000 of them were in oil debates right here!.

And when you get right down to it what difference does it make where the information I used come from if its good, correct, confirmed, and helpful?

I never worked up the oilology thread trying to look or present myself as some super smart person, I was ask to do it, so I did, and I tried to do it in a way that reflected the endless questions that have been about oil on the forum, so I used a Q&A format!

No! it's not copied and pasted here, someone else may have copied and pasted it from this forum??? But I typed every letter of it and worked out the layout!

Now you being new here means you don't know much about the people here, but it looks like your doing a CRASH landing.

If you have some questions about oil then FIRE away! I'll do my best to help you as will others. And if you want to debate oil, well I'll do that as well. But! if your going to do a debate then may I ask you to just start a NEW topic so that the Oilology thread won't get cluttered with all the post that can go into a two week debate. I'll stay with the debate as Long as it stays productive! slamming each other, name calling, belittling one another and I'm out of there!

Last but not least!
There isn't any additive in MOST of the heavy duty truck oils that would have an adverse effect on a wet clutch!
Chevron Delo would come the closet because it does have a pretty high content of Moly! but the previous owner of my free 81 Gold Wing has the Delo in the wing and its working fine and has done so for a number of years.
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post #26 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-13-2009, 10:31 PM
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Re: what if

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkC

And the the owners manual does tell us we CAN use other oils other than Honda specific oil, but the oil needs to meet certain requirements!

Yea, those stealers really like it when they can convince someone that the only oil they can put in their bike is sold at a STEALER ship! and the parts counter people go right along with it! LOL!
markc, you are right about the manual telling you this but there are COUNTLESS OTHER motorcycle oil out there it DOES NOT have to be Honda brand, and thats what the manual is talking about, sure you can use auto oil in a non-wet clutch. The damage it can cause and cost to repair is not work the little saved. I did look over your page and it was not where I found info. I'm glad you work on forktrucks and they are closer to autos than bikes. I don't think you were ever formally trained in motorcycle repair and I have seen dealers pay people to put bikes together with out ANY training. I will give you credit on your cutting apart filters, and there is lots of truth about some of the brands of filters.
As for me, I payed me dues on the line and enjoyed many years at the factory and hated to see her close and those jobs go across the big water. It all comes down to not putting out info that harm others peoples hard earned property and if your not in a test facility with the hard data and hours of testing on the OUTCOME then don't be a poser. Your not paying the price in the long run, everyone else is.

Peace and God Bless
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post #27 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 04:28 AM Thread Starter
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Re: what if

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbikes.rule
markc, you are right about the manual telling you this but there are COUNTLESS OTHER motorcycle oil out there it DOES NOT have to be Honda brand, and thats what the manual is talking about, sure you can use auto oil in a non-wet clutch. The damage it can cause and cost to repair is not work the little saved. I did look over your page and it was not where I found info. I'm glad you work on forktrucks and they are closer to autos than bikes. I don't think you were ever formally trained in motorcycle repair and I have seen dealers pay people to put bikes together with out ANY training. I will give you credit on your cutting apart filters, and there is lots of truth about some of the brands of filters.
As for me, I payed me dues on the line and enjoyed many years at the factory and hated to see her close and those jobs go across the big water. It all comes down to not putting out info that harm others peoples hard earned property and if your not in a test facility with the hard data and hours of testing on the OUTCOME then don't be a poser. Your not paying the price in the long run, everyone else is.

Peace and God Bless
Well, I have KNOWN more than one dealer that sold there motorcycle branded line of motorcycle oil off the shelf, but when servicing a bike (non warranty) they used Valvoline 10W-40 from one of those LARGE rack mounted bulk oil drums! (fact). Of course they didn't charge you for that LOL!

You still have the wrong idea about me. I NEVER, EVER, recommended the idea of using a non motorcycle specific oil. Most people that do that are already curious about the idea anyway, they are already LOOKING for the information, asking questions. I don't go around lobbying the concept. The only thing I did or do is try to put the idea in a SIMPLE form and EASY to find.

They are oil companies that now have gotten on the band wagon with motorcycle specific oils (thats a bottle of oil with a picture of a motorcycle on it) that before they did, recommended there OTHER oil as safe and good for motorcycle wet clutch applications!
Chevron,
Valvoline,
among others.

I don't know if Shell oil still has their "Motorcycle" forum still up but a short time ago that had a HUGE following of motorcycle owners that LOVED the Rotella-T oils for their Asian motorcycles!

So, lets see,

You have NO IDEA why you can't use non motorcycle specific oils in our bikes, other than it doesn't seem like a good idea to you

Honda doesn't want us to. (no body would expect any less)

The Stealers say its BAD and not to do it. (What most people know that behind that is a loss of money for them)

And you read the manual and read it as they are saying "Motorcycle Specific oils only" I think in a court of law you would lose that point

You know its fine that you don't agree with the information in this thread, but why crash land and bash it and me when you only have BAD thoughts, or it just don't seem right about non specific motorcycle oils being used in our bikes and nothing at all to back it up, what's up with that??

You say I'm BS'in people but they are countless testimonies to the use of these oils in motorcycles, and countless praise reports about using them.

When I did the oilology post I figured that some DAY some BRAIN from some oil company (chemist maybe) would come along that could break all the oil information down, and just take over the WHOLE oil topic, maybe even create a NEW AND IMPROVED Oilology thread, but that's not happened yet.

Also,
I Never Claimed to be a chemist, be certified, nor highly trained, nor did I ever try to get people to believe otherwise.

The information that I put in this thread is SIMPLE, basic, and NOT high tech. But it sure has helped to reduce oil debates on the forum, and your the FIRST to bash it out of thousands of members here Yes! I know that they are people here that WOULD never consider running nothing but motorcycle specific oils in their bikes, and that's fine!
but like I said before, this topic isn't for those people, its for the ones that ALREADY have the thinking that there is something rotten in Demark with the "Motorcycle Specific" oil deal! the informtion here is to HELP to save them from going down a bad road.
I've said many times in the past that if someone is going to go this route that's okay, BUT!!! do some research! And this topic is my collection (collective) information that I have gathered up sense around 1971 when I started working on Motorcross bikes,
from there as an Auto mechanic,

To working as a mechanic in a warehouse,

To doing ALL my own maintenance on every vehicle I ever OWNED! and at one time I owned 5 motorcycles, PLUS my car, my wifes car, and TWO stepsons that had cars (I helped them maintain theirs at that time). and I have ALWAYS been picky about motor oils!!!

From emails to oil compaines,

From searching the internet,

From working around (for a short time)at a Stealer ship!

From a motorcycle mechanic friend that is both Honda and Yamaha certified that I've known sense 1981 when I bought my first Virago and he did the warranty work on it for me, he now has his own bike service shop. By the way, unless the customer brings in his own oil, my friend will put Castrol GTX oil in the bike. And if it causes a clutch problem he would have to warranty the repair. Well he has been putting that oil in wet clutch motorcycle FOR YEARS! and he has NEVER had a engine problem of ANY kind that was oil related!!!

So, yes! my information is "Collective" But your Uncertain feelings, your fear, your thinking that the world is FLAT!! isn't going to make me re-write or take down the oilology topic! Sorry!

I'm not trained in cutting oil filters apart either! But thanks for noticing that
MarkC

P.S The oilology thread has a post date, but that date isn't correct! what happened is this forum out grew its old server and when it was moved most of EVERYTHING started over from that date! Thats also why you see members with HUGE numbers of post in just a few months.
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post #28 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 11:16 PM
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I have owned several motorcycles over the years. I have always maintained them as well as my other vehicles myself, rebuilt my own engines, and been doing this for over 30 years. I have NEVER used the first drop of motorcycle oil in a motorcycle, and even use the dreaded Fram filter for everything I own, and have had ZERO problems. Not very scientific but just my experience.


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post #29 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 11:22 PM
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Good Evening markc,

No I not trying to trash you or I'd contact so old friends to post, thats not why I posted and I see the TOPIC (word) has been up a while. I just found the forum in the last few day like it was here for years before you. Your quote about "oil company (chemist maybe) coming by" I don't think they care since they make both types. And I don't know why you call Honda and Yamaha STEALERS, they make fine bikes. I'm sorry to hear that dealers use auto oils but I don't doubt that. Most people not having problems (and not all) may not keep the bike more than a few years, most people trade up to a larger or newer model. You may even get by with running Crisco.. lol and I'm glad to own up to saying your not a professional. Maybe that will have people think before taking your advice. There are countless forums and I think most people take the TOPIC (theres that word in proper use again) as tongue in cheek. I hope the same go's here.

Good Night markc, you still have your little bubble.
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post #30 of 360 (permalink) Old 05-14-2009, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morepower
I have owned several motorcycles over the years. I have always maintained them as well as my other vehicles myself, rebuilt my own engines, and been doing this for over 30 years. I have NEVER used the first drop of motorcycle oil in a motorcycle, and even use the dreaded Fram filter for everything I own, and have had ZERO problems. Not very scientific but just my experience.
Hello morepower,

I just seen you post, Nice Bike and I can see you do very nice work. I think when it comes down to the engine getting lub about all oils do the job these days. And your experience shows, The thing most about this topic is someone thinking they can use a restore type oil or a slick 50, STP in their bike. Again, Cool Bike.



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