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Getting fuel system issues worked out on my '97 ACE 1100. I so, so want to find the crack smoker engineer who thought it was a good idea to mount the fuel pump and filter under the air box, and have to pull the swing arm to replace a pump. REALLY?! WTF WERE YOU THINKING?!
And the way the choke cables are mounted in the carbs, so you can't get a wrench on them, and everything with fingertips, and they're plastic and easy to cross-thread....
Ready to light a match.
 

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Yep,,, that's a rant. I used to think that was the worst design ever (excluding the Chevy Vega, that was NOT designed, but assembled by committee or something) THEN I changed the rear motor mount on my 97 Celica...4 bolts, how tough could it be? 10 HOURS later,,,

I've heard of a couple on the Ace Tourer forum who say they have changed the pump without pulling the swingarm.
 

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I feel your pain, I have plenty of unbelievably STUPID automotive engineering designs I could regale you with, If I am ever chatting with someone, and the subject of what someone does for a living and they say "I'm an automotive engineer" POW! They'll get a punch in the face.
But we need to remember, they design them to be built in the shortest time possible, not to be worked on.
Still doesn't change me giving them a bloody nose.
 

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1983 Honda vt750 Shadow
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13,769 Posts
I feel the same. Many years working on cars wondering why don't they consider serviceablity in the design?
But as more equipment gets added on, they have to smash everything into the area available and let some poor mechanic rip his knuckles off trying to fix it. Engineers never skin their knuckles. Quite a few times I said I would like to kick that guy in the nuts.

Some guys relocate an aftermarket fuel pump and filter on the 1100's.
 

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2000 Honda Shadow Spirit VT1100C
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2,974 Posts
I feel the same. Many years working on cars wondering why don't they consider serviceablity in the design?
But as more equipment gets added on, they have to smash everything into the area available and let some poor mechanic rip his knuckles off trying to fix it. Engineers never skin their knuckles. Quite a few times I said I would like to kick that guy in the nuts.

Some guys relocate an aftermarket fuel pump and filter on the 1100's.
swifty, I had a car one time that I had to drop the rear bumper to change the light bulb in the tail lamps. It's been many years, but I swear it was my 1968 Chevy Impala.
 

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1999 Shadow 750 ACE VT750CD3 Modified
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2,417 Posts
I think the worst I've ever seen was my brother's Audi R5 V8, with some things you had to pull the front body clip or drop the rear sub frame.
I'm sure it all went together well on the assembly line, but was light years away from the relative servicing ease of the ancestral VW beetle.
 

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06' VT1100C99' GL1500C Valkyrie
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One of the reasons I upgraded to a Valk as I wasn't looking forward to working on anything outside of normal maintenance. The Valk is well engineered in comparison.
 

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I have a 2000 ace tourer
Remove the seats
I had to loosen airbox hoses and remove airbox bolts
Remove the battery and box
Remove the rear fender

Then I was able to reach the nuts holding the fuel pump.
My new pump is now mounted in the toolbox.
 

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2015 Shadow Aero, 1972 Triumph 650 Tiger
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742 Posts
Tn my friends '94 Camaro the coil is bolted underneath the water pump and when the water pump goes and leaks onto the coil the entire electrical system fries. And then there are the older Triumph motorcycles that were never reengineered.
 

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84 VT500C retro bobber
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I have no formal mechanical training, I learned by doing. In my business I work on every make and model and Ive seen some **** I just cant explain. Why would a presumably educated engineer design something so stupid? Why on a 2002 Range Rover does the alternator sit inside a water jacket in the block? Why do you have to pull the engine on a 99 Buick Roadmaster to change the spark plugs? Why do you have to take the cab off of a 6.0l Ford Super Duty to work on the turbo? Ever done a water pump on a vw/audi? Its a plastic hamster wheel set inside the block and behind the timing belt. Its very common for the plastic wheel to lose grip on the metal shaft and then you need new pump. You have to take the front bumper , grill, head lights, rad, a/c condenser, rad support, fans and shroud out of the way just to get at the stupid thing.
 

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2015 Shadow Aero, 1972 Triumph 650 Tiger
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742 Posts
Vehicles are now becoming throwaways at the expense of a "quick" sale.
 

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2007 VT750DC Spirit “chopper”
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Vehicles are now becoming throwaways as the expense of a "quick" sale.
Vehicles have been made as throw-away for decades, I would cite the first gen Ford Festiva and Hyundai Excel as witnesses, but there aren’t any left.
 

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2015 Shadow Aero, 1972 Triumph 650 Tiger
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742 Posts
A lot of this design chitte stems from Congress, EPA and air quality standards.
 

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I have often said that IF a car (or motorcycle) manufacturer were to ever decide to engineer and build a line of vehicles to be "Extremely Reliable and easy to service"... they would rule the world. The car would only have to get "Good" gas mileage...not fantastic mileage with super complex, unreliable direct injection, variable valve timing, electric motor assist systems and high end computer control. Over build all the mechanical aspects of the engine, transmission and chassis to be able to withstand neglect and torture...and still not fail or rust out. I would be ok with an old fashion longitudinal engine and transmission arrangement... as long as the components were totally reliable. Obviously, some computer control will be needed for the engine to pass minimum emission requirements, but make sure all electrical components are bullet proof and easy to pull and replace if a failure were to occur. The vehicle does not need to be sporty of fast.... just 100% reliable and reasonably good looking. Keep the same hardware for as long as possible... improving the reliability at every turn. Every aspect of the design must revolve around extreme reliability and ease of service. The world NEEDS vehicles like this. I'm in my 60's now... I have long ago lost interest in super fast cars and motorcycles... I want RELIABILITY, safety and decent mileage and looks....not much else. My Honda Shadow comes fairly close...but even it... has lots of room for improvement.
 

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2002, Shadow Spirit 1100
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1,238 Posts
I have often said that IF a car (or motorcycle) manufacturer were to ever decide to engineer and build a line of vehicles to be "Extremely Reliable and easy to service"... they would rule the world. The car would only have to get "Good" gas mileage...not fantastic mileage with super complex, unreliable direct injection, variable valve timing, electric motor assist systems and high end computer control. Over build all the mechanical aspects of the engine, transmission and chassis to be able to withstand neglect and torture...and still not fail or rust out. I would be ok with an old fashion longitudinal engine and transmission arrangement... as long as the components were totally reliable. Obviously, some computer control will be needed for the engine to pass minimum emission requirements, but make sure all electrical components are bullet proof and easy to pull and replace if a failure were to occur. The vehicle does not need to be sporty of fast.... just 100% reliable and reasonably good looking. Keep the same hardware for as long as possible... improving the reliability at every turn. Every aspect of the design must revolve around extreme reliability and ease of service. The world NEEDS vehicles like this. I'm in my 60's now... I have long ago lost interest in super fast cars and motorcycles... I want RELIABILITY, safety and decent mileage and looks....not much else. My Honda Shadow comes fairly close...but even it... has lots of room for improvement.
If you are interested in off road riding or local commuting the TW 200 is a lot as you described. I'm getting up near 47,000 miles on mine with no overhaul, 1 valve job, 1 carburetor overhaul and then the regular stuff, tires, tubes, chain, oil, seat cover regular wear items.
 
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